Thursday, 10 June 2010

Punishing Deniers

I don't deny the Holocaust, though I might question the numbers, perhaps it was even worse than the law in various countries say it was but that makes me a criminal in their eyes.
Just as real scientists insist that everything is open to question (eg Climate Change) so real historians know that history is never 'settled' as new information and interpretations come along.
The problem with using the law to decide the history of the Holocaust is that that tendancy was always going to spread and so it has.

Hungary, that brave and friendly republic in Central Europe, has passed a bill equating Communist era crimes to the Holocaust and banned denying it under threat of imprisonment. Those denying, casting doubts on, or depreciating the crimes committed by the Communist regime will be facing from one to three years behind bars.

Russia Today, Communist Crimes Denial equates to Holocaust Denial


Apart from the problems that will give to the many surviving members of the former Communist regime, many of whom still believe that regime to have been positive, what next might be on the list?
Colonialism perhaps, or that every aspect of Slavery was the fault of Europeans and it's not just history; Climate Change skeptics have long been called "deniers" and many would like that to become a criminal offence, the evil EU already has laws forbiding bringing that sorry institution into disrepute.
Perhaps Mr. Cameron would consider a new law forbidding the denial that Labour governments always run out of other peoples money.

My initial doubts about criminalising a view of history that goes against the orthodox opinion have been vindicated and it can only get worse.

10 comments:

Captain Haddock said...

OK .. so if the facts don't fit your agenda, you manipulate the facts to suit ..

If that doesn't convince everyone that your conclusion is the only correct one, you "create" false facts, supported by so-called "experts" ..

If people still remain unconvinced, or even worse challenge both your "facts" & your "conclusions" .. you introduce legislation to make such questioning illegal ..

Fucking great .. little wonder that no-one trusts "experts" any longer ..

Guess I'd better pack a toothbrush .. just in case ..

banned said...

Too true Captain, because you never know when the Truth Nazis might come kicking down your door.

scunnert said...

Thought crimes are never a good thing.

Dick Puddlecote said...

Good point, Banned. I was close to putting this in my link tank earlier as I thought it was quite funny.

But, as you say, just because lefties like to use such methods, doesn't mean anyone is gaining some moral high ground by throwing them back at them.

Though I can think of some socialists I'd like to bang up if such a law was brought in over here. ;-)

Amusing Bunni said...

The news just keeps getting crazier by the minute.
So much for free speech. Keep the truth Nazi's away from all of us. I don't like thought police either.

banned said...

Thanks for your comments, right here goes. Nazism was designed to be evil whereas Communism was arrogant wishful thinking that had to be corrupted to present an appearance of success and for that reason the crimes of the communists were less evil than those of the Nazis.

European Arrest Warrant coming my way from a magistrate in Székesfehérvár?

Ron Russell said...

I don't know if the numbers of the Holocaust have been expanded over the years---anyways numbers do not matter, its the crimes. Banning the denial is not the way to go. If someone chooses not to believe something thats their business and the state needs to keep hands off! Free speech is vital!

Harbinger said...

I've done a great deal of reading on the Holocaust and there are just too many questions that still need to be answered that simply piss over the 'official' version.

In a court of law, lies can be defeated by the truth, whereas the truth cannot be defeated by lies, well that's what I thought anyway, but it seems that should anyone dare investigate one such "taboo" in history and disagree with the official story then the courts will meet the truth with brutality and throw people into prison.

Ironically the industry that has developed from the holocaust (see Norman Finklestein) has funded Israel's illegal growth and worse still it's treatment of 'deniers' has been no different to the persecution of the Jews (of course not forgetting all others) under the 3rd Reich. Talk about hypocrisy?

Sadly imprisoning people for freedom of thought and speech does the exact opposite to what it sets out to do - shut people up. It's force and counterforce - the more you push against something the more recoil you create. Common sense. Time to have a debate about this and not imprison people for having a differing opinion regardless!

banned said...

Ron & Harbinger, sorry I did not get back to you at the time, I was having something of a blogging crisis at the time

"My initial doubts about criminalising a view of history that goes against the orthodox opinion have been vindicated and it can only get worse. "

18th Dec. 2010

http://www.allseeingeye.net/2010/12/thought-crimes.html

Harbinger said...

Hello Banned,

My, you took a long time to reply - lol. Thanks for the link and I'm reading it now. It's very interesting isn't it?
What is interesting is that to deny the holocaust is actually not only logical but perfectly correct. THERE WAS NO JEWISH HOLOCAUST! I of course state that there was no mass destruction of Jewish people by fire (Greek: Holo = Whole, Caust = Fire). There were however Jews interned in work camps along with millions of others in order to maintain the German war effort and far more non Jews died in these camps than Jews did. We are also continuously reminded in every Hollywood movie of the 'holocaust' and yet what about the real holocausts - Hiroshima, Nagasaki & Dresden amongst others? Now the hundreds of thousands of people who died in these attacks did by 'whole fire.'

It is certainly correct that one could say the Jews were persecuted by the Nazis, but then so were far more non Jews. Let us also not forget Banned, that it was the Jews who launched a war against the Germans first and the reason why the Nazis painted Jewish star of Davids on their businesses was to tell non Jews to boycott them as the Jews were doing to the Germans. Of course history lied to us about this as well saying it was the Germans singling out the Jews.

Remember also that much of our history is from the victor's point of view.

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